Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 10, 2024 6:43:57 GMT -5
You're right, I reread it. I skipped over the part of where spotted tilapia are erroneously called Oscars. You are correct to the extent that oscars are in the same overall family of fish that tilapia are in. Oscars are cichlids. Means they are mouth brooders. There’s an African branch and a South American branch of the family. Oscars are of the South American side, tilapia are from the African branch. The various other cichlids in south Florida are closer relatives of oscars than tilapia are. Oscars have a lot of personality. They’re like aquatic puppies in a home fish tank. They’ll beg for human attention from across the room. They’ll also rearrange a fish tank to their liking and will secretly move things back where they want them when no human is looking if a human changes things in the tank. Oscars are Cichlids fro South America. But they're not mouth brooders. They're pretty typical egg laying Cichlids. I've bred them in the aquarium a few times. Nowadays the fish keeping industry produces them in all kinds of different colours. And there are even hideous long finned versions in the hobby! They've even been hybridised with ther species. You can see a few here :- www.alwayspets.com/s/oscar-fish-colors-f36abd9a7d474a3eBut when released into the wild these fish will always eventually revert back to their wild type in a few generations. They die off regularly in Florida due to cold snaps.
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 10, 2024 6:46:43 GMT -5
one more exotic - believe this is a "jaguar guapote" Jaguar Guapote aka Jaguar Cichlid aka Parachromis managuensis 100%. In the aquarium, these things make Oscars look like . They grow larger and are more territorial. Both make pretty good eating.
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 10, 2024 6:54:20 GMT -5
Mayans are found in massive numbers in the canals on the western side of I41. Big Cypress is full of them. You often see the males in spawning colours with bright red chests. You'll also see pits in which the parents have spawned and are often protecting young fry. I've also caught them in the brackish Lake Placid and have read that they can adapt to full saltwater condition. They're one really tough species which is why there's so many of them.
I've also caught a few Black Acara here which are another small type of South American Cichlid.
Further East the oscar populations seem to start. You can find big shoals of them too. Lots of them in the canals next to the loop road in dry season. I've only ever seen a couple of Jaguar Cichlids here though.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Sept 10, 2024 8:18:34 GMT -5
Lake Placid FL, brackish?
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 10, 2024 8:52:16 GMT -5
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Post by Crkr 23 on Sept 10, 2024 9:01:44 GMT -5
👍, the freshwater lake in Highlands county came to mind. It's a good day, I learned something.
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Post by tampaspicer on Sept 10, 2024 16:00:52 GMT -5
We use to catch some type of Cichlids in the ditches of the neighborhood I grew up in Tampa.
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 11, 2024 11:17:46 GMT -5
A few additional items... In my area, down here in south Florida the canals we fish along edge of the 'glades, west of Ft. Lauderdale... the oscars get much bigger (and more common, for comparison -think largest crappie...) than those few jaguar guapotes we catch and release. Locals that fish those canals for eating fish say that the Mayans are much better eating than the oscars (but the oscars look to have much more meat on each side than the mayan cichlids..) go figure... Lastly, the mayans are so widely distributed in the freshwater parts of the backcountry = that I know anglers who make a point of working hardbaits (topwater, subsurface...) in mayan colors for snook, tarpon, and other species - particularly in places where largemouth bass are present in the same waters as those "saltwater" species... In other words, they've become a definite forage specie, well accepted by the predators in those areas... Just nothing like the 'glades... Have you ever come across Midas Cichlids (Amphilophus citrinellus ) Bob? I've seen them caught in Youtube videos in Florida, but never come across one myself. I believe they're found closer to Miami. According to Wikipedia, this is a currently list of known invasive fish in the sunshine state. Including four different types of 'pleco' catfish. Acanthogobius flavimanus (Yellowfin goby) Amphilophus citrinellus (Midas cichlid) Astronotus ocellatus (Oscar) Belonesox belizanus (Pike killifish) Channa aurolineata (Goldline snakehead) Chitala ornata (Clown featherback) Cichla ocellaris (Butterfly peacock bass) Cichlasoma bimaculatum (Black acara) Clarias batrachus (Walking catfish) Ctenopharyngodon idella (Grass carp) Cyprinus carpio (Eurasian carp) Hemichromis letourneuxi (African jewelfish) Herichthys cyanoguttatus (Texas cichlid) Heros severus (Banded cichlid) Heterotilapia buttikoferi (Zebra tilapia) Hoplosternum littorale (Brown hoplo) Hypostomus plecostomus (Suckermouth catfish) Ictalurus furcatus (Blue catfish) Mayaheros urophthalmus (Mayan cichlid) Monopterus albus (Asian swamp eel) Oreochromis aureus (Blue tilapia) Oreochromis mossambicus (Mozambique tilapia) Oreochromis niloticus (Nile tilapia) Parachromis managuensis (Jaguar cichlid) Pterois miles (Common lionfish) Pterois volitans (Red lionfish) Pelmatolapia mariae (Spotted tilapia) Pterygoplichthys disjunctivus (Vermiculated sailfin catfish) Pterygoplichthys multiradiatus (Orinoco sailfin catfish) Pterygoplichthys pardalis (Amazon sailfin catfish) Pylodictis olivaris (Flathead catfish) Sarotherodon melanotheron (Blackchin tilapia)
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Post by lemaymiami on Sept 12, 2024 6:55:34 GMT -5
As usual - bad info on Wiki... The peacock bass was deliberately introduced here in the very early eighties or late seventies (with permission from from the predecessor to the current FWC). The idea was that south Florida, particularly in Dade county (earlier name it's currently Miami-Dade county...) in an effort to introduce a predator to control all the small invasives in every canal.. It was believed that the peacock could not survive winters outside of that area and the program was very successful and also provided an addtional game fish for anglers... What was not anticipated is that waters to the north (Broward and Palm Beach counties) in urban areas might also allow populations to exist... Like I said, the peacock bass is not an "invasive" at all - it was sanctioned from the first... and carefully monitored. An additional specie was also introduced legally some years ago - the grass carp - meant to aid in control of weed growth in local canals since they're vegetarians and grow large it was thought that they'd greatly reduce weed growth. I have no idea whether that program was a succcess... I've only caught one clown knifefish, and it was on a lure. Not many of them around but they are an outstanding gamefish and my customers would be well pleased with any one they encountered. Most that do fish them use live bait. If I could figure out a way to catch them on flies - I'd have a lot of bookings for them locally -particularly in Lake Ida or Lake Norman here in Broward county... Here's a pic of the only one I've encountered, well over ten pounds. Locals call them "featherbacks" . If you have a pic of that Midas Cichlid, I'll be able to tell you if we've ever come across one. Once it cools off a bit each year (end of this month all the way until next May) there will be a lot of days when catching (and releasing) 100 exotics using lures or flies in a five hour trip is a real possibility and many of them are ones you only see every now and then..
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Post by conchydong on Sept 12, 2024 8:19:55 GMT -5
As usual - bad info on Wiki... The peacock bass was deliberately introduced here in the very early eighties or late seventies (with permission from from the predecessor to the current FWC). The idea was that south Florida, particularly in Dade county (earlier name it's currently Miami-Dade county...) in an effort to introduce a predator to control all the small invasives in every canal.. It was believed that the peacock could not survive winters outside of that area and the program was very successful and also provided an addtional game fish for anglers... What was not anticipated is that waters to the north (Broward and Palm Beach counties) in urban areas might also allow populations to exist... Like I said, the peacock bass is not an "invasive" at all - it was sanctioned from the first... and carefully monitored. An additional specie was also introduced legally some years ago - the grass carp - meant to aid in control of weed growth in local canals since they're vegetarians and grow large it was thought that they'd greatly reduce weed growth. I have no idea whether that program was a succcess... I've only caught one clown knifefish, and it was on a lure. Not many of them around but they are an outstanding gamefish and my customers would be well pleased with any one they encountered. Most that do fish them use live bait. If I could figure out a way to catch them on flies - I'd have a lot of bookings for them locally -particularly in Lake Ida or Lake Norman here in Broward county... Here's a pic of the only one I've encountered, well over ten pounds. Locals call them "featherbacks" . If you have a pic of that Midas Cichlid, I'll be able to tell you if we've ever come across one. Once it cools off a bit each year (end of this month all the way until next May) there will be a lot of days when catching (and releasing) 100 exotics using lures or flies in a five hour trip is a real possibility and many of them are ones you only see every now and then.. Bob, I love your posts but I disagree (with the exception of Peacocks) releasing the non-natives back into the waters (alive). I realize your customers may enjoy catching them but you know what happens to the native species when invasives take over.
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 12, 2024 9:11:18 GMT -5
As usual - bad info on Wiki... The peacock bass was deliberately introduced here in the very early eighties or late seventies (with permission from from the predecessor to the current FWC). The idea was that south Florida, particularly in Dade county (earlier name it's currently Miami-Dade county...) in an effort to introduce a predator to control all the small invasives in every canal.. It was believed that the peacock could not survive winters outside of that area and the program was very successful and also provided an addtional game fish for anglers... What was not anticipated is that waters to the north (Broward and Palm Beach counties) in urban areas might also allow populations to exist... Like I said, the peacock bass is not an "invasive" at all - it was sanctioned from the first... and carefully monitored. An additional specie was also introduced legally some years ago - the grass carp - meant to aid in control of weed growth in local canals since they're vegetarians and grow large it was thought that they'd greatly reduce weed growth. I have no idea whether that program was a succcess... I've only caught one clown knifefish, and it was on a lure. Not many of them around but they are an outstanding gamefish and my customers would be well pleased with any one they encountered. Most that do fish them use live bait. If I could figure out a way to catch them on flies - I'd have a lot of bookings for them locally -particularly in Lake Ida or Lake Norman here in Broward county... Here's a pic of the only one I've encountered, well over ten pounds. Locals call them "featherbacks" . If you have a pic of that Midas Cichlid, I'll be able to tell you if we've ever come across one. Once it cools off a bit each year (end of this month all the way until next May) there will be a lot of days when catching (and releasing) 100 exotics using lures or flies in a five hour trip is a real possibility and many of them are ones you only see every now and then.. I wouldn't say it's bad info per se. The definition of 'invasive species ' doesn't really change if it's a government sanctioned introduction or a moron deliberately releasing the inhabitants of their fish tank. The end result as you've seen, can be just the same. You'll find many instances of governments making similar mistakes around the globe when things didn't turn out as planned. What makes me laugh is how those invasives with sporting value seem to be protected rather than eradicated.
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Post by illinoisfisherman on Sept 18, 2024 15:12:47 GMT -5
Teddy Roosevelt was instrumental in introducing common carp into American waters. Was it a mistake if it fed our citizens when our fish stocks were depleted? It seems carp can exist with game fish
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 19, 2024 4:26:08 GMT -5
If you have a pic of that Midas Cichlid, I'll be able to tell you if we've ever come across one. Once it cools off a bit each year (end of this month all the way until next May) there will be a lot of days when catching (and releasing) 100 exotics using lures or flies in a five hour trip is a real possibility and many of them are ones you only see every now and then.. Sorry Bob, I missed this. This is a Midas Cichlid Amphilophus citrinellus
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Mynki
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Post by Mynki on Sept 19, 2024 4:29:01 GMT -5
Teddy Roosevelt was instrumental in introducing common carp into American waters. Was it a mistake if it fed our citizens when our fish stocks were depleted? It seems carp can exist with game fish Back then people didn't understand the complications and potential financial impacts of invasive species. Do Americans actually eat carp though? I've tried it in Prague in the Czech Republic where it's quite popular there and in other East European countries. It's edible, but not particularly good. Incidentally, they're found throughout Western Europe as the Romans introduced them as food fishes also. Depending on who you believe...
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Post by tonyroma on Sept 19, 2024 11:19:31 GMT -5
I know of nobody who would even consider eating a carp.
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