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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 20, 2023 7:49:24 GMT -5
Grape vines are a great food source. Deer feed on the young leaves and tendrils. The problem is that they are so widespread that it is hard to pinpoint the exact place to be especially when bowhunting. This changes in August when they start dropping grapes, they will zero on the vines that are dropping. I have found that the grape vines that produce the most consistently are the ones that are growing in the tree tops. The picture above was taken in my backyard and you can see where they have fed on the leaves leaving just stems. Attachments:
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Post by bigred89 on Jul 20, 2023 8:02:32 GMT -5
I don't remember what these are called, but deer and bear enjoyed them. Attachments:
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 20, 2023 8:13:06 GMT -5
I ran it on the plant app and it came back as tallow wood, also known as hog plum, yellow plum or sea lemon.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 20, 2023 8:36:52 GMT -5
Poke weed, picture is not a great example, later in the year the stems turn a reddish/ purple color and the berries become blackish/purple. Sometimes when blood trailing around them the berries can throw you of the trail as they leave a blood like stain when they hit the ground, ask me how I know. I've found the best way to hunt over them is over young clear-cuts especially if the timber companies have pushed up debris piles, poke weed thrives in the nutrient rich piles. Attachments:
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Post by tampaspicer on Jul 20, 2023 14:27:55 GMT -5
Persimmons another good one
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 21, 2023 10:02:43 GMT -5
Yes, persimmon is an excellent food source especially as a " Kill Zone " as in not all persimmons produce fruit. Most of the trees that you find are males. When you find that fruit bearing female tree it can be something special.
I will try to post some pictures of a producing tree when I find it.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 21, 2023 10:08:20 GMT -5
Beautyberry bush, deer eat the berries and leaves. You can eat the berries yourself but they don't have much taste, It also makes great jelly. The leaves can be used as an insect repellent just by rubbing it on you. Attachments:
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Post by tampaspicer on Jul 21, 2023 10:58:49 GMT -5
If you have any honey suckle on the property you hunt it's a great late season spot. I use to hunt a property in Georgia that had this huge canopy of honey suckle that had grown over an old log pile from a previous clear cut. Spot was maybe 50' x 50'. Those deer would browse the canopy up as high as they could reach.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 22, 2023 7:42:29 GMT -5
I hunted a piece of property in Alabama that was loaded with Japanese honeysuckle. The timber company used the old practice of clearing land by making long windrows and the honeysuckle thrived in them. The deer also thrived in the windrows, they could bed and eat without much movement. Today on the same property the timber company changed their land management practices to using herbicides. You can hardly find any honeysuckle on the property at all and the hunting went downhill. Attachments:
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 22, 2023 7:56:56 GMT -5
Sparkleberry or huckleberry, you can eat it too, little tart though. Attachments:
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Post by One Man Gang on Jul 22, 2023 8:44:21 GMT -5
Keep em coming cracker. That's good info.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 23, 2023 5:04:24 GMT -5
American Black Nightshade, it normally has small green berries that turns black when ripe. This one really surprised me when I found deer eating it in a burn pile in my back yard, it looked like you took a weed eater to the tops of it. All my life I had been taught to pull it up when I found it because it was deadly to cows and horses yet here the deer were eating it. It may or may not a preferred food source but deer do eat it. Attachments:
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Post by bowhunter4life on Jul 23, 2023 5:33:13 GMT -5
Part of becoming a good deer hunter is learning what food sources the deer use throughout the year on that area.. Different parts of our state offer different foods and it’s always changing throughout the year. Nothing beats time in the woods to learn this. I was hunting a flag pond and watched deer come into it throughout the day to eat the flowers that were growing from water hyacinths…. Always learn something in the woods.
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Post by bswiv on Jul 23, 2023 5:35:59 GMT -5
Knowing what they eat is important.
In the long run, though, it is vital, imperative, indispensable, to manage land for the plants. Do that and there will be not only deer and turkeys and quail but also all the other wildlife that so often adds to the joy of sitting quietly in a stand.
The political conditions ( liability ) that have driven timber companies to herbicide and mowing rather than fire is something we need to be aware of.
I could go on about this.....a while......but if we do not get behind altering our view of "smoke in the air" during proper parts of the year our woods will deteriorate. And this will be both private and public lands.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 23, 2023 6:17:33 GMT -5
I agree, burning is the best land management tool we have, it is also is the probably the least used.
I believe that the use of herbicides have affected us way more than we believe. IMO the loss of grass in the St Johns could be contributed to use of herbicides, think, run-off from timberlands, indiscriminate spraying of invasive plants and even the homeowner who treats and fertilizes his beautiful St Augustine lawn. Heck, I was guilty of it myself.
I'm a little sensitive to the subject of herbicides because as I type this out I'm going through my 5th cycle of chemo for NH lymphoma which may or may not have come the use of one of the most popular herbicides out there, Round Up.
So back to the subject, yes we need to burn the woods. If you don't like the smoke move your Yankee ass back to where you come from. If you ain't got enough sense to not drive when you can't see, you get what you deserve.
I guess I need to shut up, think I'm having anger issues from the steroids.
Ben I appreciate you bringing up the subject of burning, I needed to vent a little, thanks.
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Post by One Man Gang on Jul 23, 2023 7:01:21 GMT -5
Excellent insights and I agree.
Good luck on your treatment Cracker. Prayer for your well being.
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Post by swampdog on Jul 23, 2023 7:11:08 GMT -5
Good to vent occasionally. Prayers for a cure with your treatment cracker.
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Post by louis357mag on Jul 23, 2023 8:20:02 GMT -5
A little fertilizer, mainly nitrogen improves honeysuckle consumption by deer. Small pieces of sparkle berry wood or grape vines in your smoker is a good thing.
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Post by Crkr 23 on Jul 23, 2023 12:18:07 GMT -5
There's a picture of the wild persimmon mentioned earlier. Attachments:
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Post by wayvis on Jul 23, 2023 13:29:22 GMT -5
Another great food source during archery season is crabapples. Deer love 'um. Just not common in many areas of florida.
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Post by wayvis on Jul 23, 2023 13:45:15 GMT -5
Knowing what they eat is important. In the long run, though, it is vital, imperative, indispensable, to manage land for the plants. Do that and there will be not only deer and turkeys and quail but also all the other wildlife that so often adds to the joy of sitting quietly in a stand. The political conditions ( liability ) that have driven timber companies to herbicide and mowing rather than fire is something we need to be aware of. , I could go on about this.....a while......but if we do not get behind altering our view of "smoke in the air" during proper parts of the year our woods will deteriorate. And this will be both private and public lands. I agree but wasn't laws passed after the fires of 98 to address liability if a burn is done appropriately? Herbicide spraying by timber companies is definitely a big problem, that has gotten worse over the years. Use to be that a clear cut was good for a few years, now it may be a good food source for a year before they spray it. Then they plant and, in another year, or so, they come back and spray again. Not much food for the deer and other wildlife. Then in another 8-10 years the pines shade out all the plants and you get the brown desert until they harvest or thin. |
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Post by altuck on Jul 23, 2023 16:32:44 GMT -5
Pear trees and fig trees are a big draw on my place right now.
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Post by bswiv on Jul 23, 2023 16:44:37 GMT -5
Knowing what they eat is important. In the long run, though, it is vital, imperative, indispensable, to manage land for the plants. Do that and there will be not only deer and turkeys and quail but also all the other wildlife that so often adds to the joy of sitting quietly in a stand. The political conditions ( liability ) that have driven timber companies to herbicide and mowing rather than fire is something we need to be aware of. , I could go on about this.....a while......but if we do not get behind altering our view of "smoke in the air" during proper parts of the year our woods will deteriorate. And this will be both private and public lands. I agree but wasn't laws passed after the fires of 98 to address liability if a burn is done appropriately? Herbicide spraying by timber companies is definitely a big problem, that has gotten worse over the years. Use to be that a clear cut was good for a few years, now it may be a good food source for a year before they spray it. Then they plant and, in another year, or so, they come back and spray again. Not much food for the deer and other wildlife. Then in another 8-10 years the pines shade out all the plants and you get the brown desert until they harvest or thin. I'm thinking we need a on site, and maybe even hands on.......prescribed fire class for the forum. |
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Post by pinman on Jul 23, 2023 16:53:43 GMT -5
Insecticides are a big issue too IMO. I dont have any data or training on the subject but common sense says you spray more and more for insects and wildlife will suffer down the line. Spaying whole lawns so Cinch bugs wont make it "ugly" and the latest thing of killing Mosquito ala "Mosquito Joe". Ive always wondered if insecticides have played s role in declining Quail and Turkey populations. Amdro, used for fire ants, looks just like a piece of cracked corn....
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Post by james14 on Jul 23, 2023 17:08:51 GMT -5
How much of the burning issue is politics? Both DoF and the WMDs burn all the time, and they're state agencies. I think the issue with the timber companies is the cost. One guy on a tractor with a sprayer is cheaper than a team plowing firebreaks and managing a fire during the handful of good prescribed burn days that occur each year. I do wish they'd burn instead. I'll never forget walking into my main spot before turkey season and seeing what I can only describe as a glyphosate bomb having gone off over about 1000 acres.
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Post by james14 on Jul 23, 2023 17:11:12 GMT -5
One thing to take note of is how deer prefer forbs over grasses.
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Post by bswiv on Jul 23, 2023 17:40:59 GMT -5
How much of the burning issue is politics? Both DoF and the WMDs burn all the time, and they're state agencies. I think the issue with the timber companies is the cost. One guy on a tractor with a sprayer is cheaper than a team plowing firebreaks and managing a fire during the handful of good prescribed burn days that occur each year. I do wish they'd burn instead. I'll never forget walking into my main spot before turkey season and seeing what I can only describe as a glyphosate bomb having gone off over about 1000 acres. Burning is actually less expensive than herbicide. The liability is what is killing it. And do not be confused by the amount of "state" & "agency" burning going on as it is insufficient to keep up with the need. You are correct about the "burn days" but it is more nuanced than that as "burn days" are significantly impacted by the fact of where smoke can not go. Plenty of good "burn days" go by the wayside not because the weather is wrong but because we can not slow down the traffic to Mouse World...... |
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Post by walkerdog on Jul 23, 2023 18:10:10 GMT -5
How much of the burning issue is politics? Both DoF and the WMDs burn all the time, and they're state agencies. I think the issue with the timber companies is the cost. One guy on a tractor with a sprayer is cheaper than a team plowing firebreaks and managing a fire during the handful of good prescribed burn days that occur each year. I do wish they'd burn instead. I'll never forget walking into my main spot before turkey season and seeing what I can only describe as a glyphosate bomb having gone off over about 1000 acres. It’s worth pointing out that the reason the state agencies can burn so much more often than non-government landowners is that they have sovereign immunity, which caps their liability at something like 250k whereas the sky is the limit on damages that can be sought against a timber company or other private landowner. Yes, they have to prove gross negligence, if the burn is conducted by a certified burner, but there is no bar set for filing a lawsuit, so the need to defend exists anytime a lawsuit is filed. |
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Post by bswiv on Jul 23, 2023 18:38:18 GMT -5
How much of the burning issue is politics? Both DoF and the WMDs burn all the time, and they're state agencies. I think the issue with the timber companies is the cost. One guy on a tractor with a sprayer is cheaper than a team plowing firebreaks and managing a fire during the handful of good prescribed burn days that occur each year. I do wish they'd burn instead. I'll never forget walking into my main spot before turkey season and seeing what I can only describe as a glyphosate bomb having gone off over about 1000 acres. It’s worth pointing out that the reason the state agencies can burn so much more often than non-government landowners is that they have sovereign immunity, which caps their liability at something like 250k whereas the sky is the limit on damages that can be sought against a timber company or other private landowner. Yes, they have to prove gross negligence, if the burn is conducted by a certified burner, but there is no bar set for filing a lawsuit, so the need to defend exists anytime a lawsuit is filed. And even for the "agencies" the Florida Forest Service will not issue permits when fire conditions in a district indicate sufficient danger to where all available FFS assets might be tied up. It's really hard for everyone the way it is. We need new and better legislation. And the FFS needs more support and a better pay/benefits package such that they can keep folks long enough to where their people have the on the job experience necessary to do what they are tasked with. Takes a long time and a bunch of seeing it happen to get were some of their really good people are. We need to make it where they can live well and do the job. |
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Post by cracker4112 on Jul 23, 2023 19:52:47 GMT -5
Man old Woodsrunner would have had a bunch to say on this thread. Fertilizing your oaks, identifying pretty much anything in the woods. This thread reminded me of him.
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